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 Post subject: Re: Dmax switch blanks
PostPosted: Sun Jul 21, 2019 6:26 am 
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Posts: 29
mydmax wrote:
Valkie.
Just hang on a minute, you are not a dummy, you have found most items and just require some other info.

If there is a high beam relay, ie, labelled as such in the lid of fuse box, then it will have (most likely 4 pins), two small and two larger. One of the small ones will be directly connected to negative.
The one of those in the base, which is connected to negative is the earthing for the relay coil, the other will become +ve when the stalk switch is set for high and also when HB flash is performed. If you can test those two base socket holes with a multi meter set on 12v and it turn on and off the meter reading with low to high selection then all good. That +ve wire or pin on relay may then be used for the activation of the Led bar relay, either by splicing into the wire or as I mentioned a few strands of wire wrapped only around that pin on the relay would suffice.
If when you select high beam from low beam and the relay clicks, then it is probable you can use it in this way so as to not alter anything but still obtain a Led bar relay coil feed.

Hope this makes sense.

If you think the wires going to the LED headlights controller can be used, one of them must originate from the main loom and high beam signal. Obviously the wires going from there to the headlights are not the ones, only those which come from the loom, if identified, one of them has to be positive only when high is ON. With a very sharp multimeter probe, ie, pin window sharp, it can be probed while switching between Low/High beam to check if it is the positive high beam signal.
All a bit of fiddling though.

Asking Isuzu or motor houses for bits to do it is often beyond them and they have no idea. it would be god if someone has a circuit diagram, that always helps.

With the two fuses you have identified, do they become on and off when high and low are alternately selected or are both ON all the time the headlights are turned on. If alternating, the High can be used with piggy back. Lacking piggy back fuse, You can use a normal blade fuse and file one side near top so a thin wire can be soldered to it, that becomes your signal wire


I like the idea of modifying the fuse.
I'll try and check the fuses today, as long as SWMBO gives me time.
Weekends generally are devoted to "doing things" that need to be done.
Alternately, I might be able to modify the piggy back to get the wire coming out the top rates than the side, this will solve that problem.

I tried looking for the feed wire from the high beam switch, as you suggested, but there is several looms behind the dash and I hate fiddling blind.
I plan to purchase a voltage probe, when I can find one, these things can detect live wires without having to poke holes in wires.
I had one years ago, but lent it to a mate who has since gone interstate, gone forever.

If I can find the feed for high beam behind the dash, it woukd be perfect.
I'll post how I go in the next week.
Thanks for your help


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 Post subject: Re: Dmax switch blanks
PostPosted: Mon Jul 22, 2019 9:49 am 
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Joined: Fri Jun 07, 2019 4:40 pm
Posts: 29
I have had a good look and contacted several loom providers.

The MUX has LED headlights
There is a 6 pin plug that plugs into another plug and 6 wires feed from this into the sealed headlight.

I cannot get a loom to piggy back off this from anyone.
I'm reluctant to start chopping into the wires because they are all so small.

I will try and get a high beam take off from the fuse for the high beam, but there isn't a lot of room inside the fuse box to fit a side entry piggy back fuse.
The bit hanging out the side interferes with the box.
I have even contacted ISUZU, they only want $900.00 to fit and supply headlights .........ONLY? I don't have that sort of money or the lack on one damn wire.


Attachments:
plug.jpg
plug.jpg [ 243.92 KiB | Viewed 704 times ]
HL saved.jpg
HL saved.jpg [ 70.56 KiB | Viewed 704 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: Dmax switch blanks
PostPosted: Mon Jul 22, 2019 10:55 am 
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Joined: Sat Oct 12, 2013 5:36 pm
Posts: 1573
Valkie
Asking Isuzu for anything, ie, mods etc, will always be a non event. A headlight fuse may be live all the time the headlights are switched ON, therefore not on only when when high beam selected. Of the wires going into the LEDheadlight controller, not the ones from it to headlights, there should be one of those loom to controller entry wires which becomes +ve ON when HB is selected. Just a sharp pin into the wire will reveal the one which is ON when HB is on.
If you find it, push the pin through the wire parting the strands. Select a thin aux wire and cut all but 3 or 4 strands from the bared end of that new wire. If inserted through the pinhole and then squeezed and taped, it will run a relay coil for you. Nothing expensive and no cutting into loom wires either
It can be removed easily if required and the place unseen.


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 Post subject: Re: Dmax switch blanks
PostPosted: Mon Jul 22, 2019 1:14 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jun 07, 2019 4:40 pm
Posts: 29
mydmax wrote:
Valkie
Asking Isuzu for anything, ie, mods etc, will always be a non event. A headlight fuse may be live all the time the headlights are switched ON, therefore not on only when when high beam selected. Of the wires going into the LEDheadlight controller, not the ones from it to headlights, there should be one of those loom to controller entry wires which becomes +ve ON when HB is selected. Just a sharp pin into the wire will reveal the one which is ON when HB is on.
If you find it, push the pin through the wire parting the strands. Select a thin aux wire and cut all but 3 or 4 strands from the bared end of that new wire. If inserted through the pinhole and then squeezed and taped, it will run a relay coil for you. Nothing expensive and no cutting into loom wires either
It can be removed easily if required and the place unseen.


I'm not quite sure what you mean.?

Are you suggesting I find the wire that goes +12volts when the high beam is activated and then bare some wires and push them into the rear of the plug at that wire?
I'm not sure if that would work.
Do you have any pictures of this being done?


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 Post subject: Re: Dmax switch blanks
PostPosted: Mon Jul 22, 2019 1:49 pm 
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Joined: Sat Oct 12, 2013 5:36 pm
Posts: 1573
Valkie
To activate a controling relay like the one in your wiring loom of the LED bar, it will omly require approx 200ma, ie, 0.2 amps to make it switch the relay ON.

Approx 50mm to 80mm on the vehicle side of th eLED headlight control, if you probe the wires, one at a time whicle switching the HB, on then off, I would be pretty sure you will find a wire which becomes 12v + when the HB is ON.
Therefore, the pin probe allows a multi meter set on 12v to detect that happening. If you find such a wire by pin probing that can be used. I have used a pin to then pass through that wire and with a few bare starnds of the additional signal wire you will use, the few starnds can be passed through the loom wire without compromising it's functionality. The new wire if squeezed at that point will contact the original wire and then laid parallel to the wire and taped it will perform the duty of suppluing a HB signal feed to the LED bar loom system. Fuse that wire with a 3amp fuse and all will be well. Every time the HB is then activated either by normal position or HB flash, the LED bar will also come on.Many points of vehicle wiring have internal connections which are crimped with a paralleled wire. They take some current. Your demand will be about the same an interior roof light or less. I have a 20100 Dmax and som efunctions I added are simple attachments, ie, a wire loop arounfd a leg of a fuse or relay pin to access the function I require. Yes you can go and buy proprietary items to do it but have to travel to buy and then cost as well.

I recently fitted a light bar to my 2010 Corolla and I use a solid state relay from jaycar. It is an electronic switch, instead of a mechanical relay. All the same idea though and run off similar points to source the signal.

Hope you get it sorted.


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 Post subject: Re: Dmax switch blanks
PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2019 10:32 am 
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Joined: Fri Jun 07, 2019 4:40 pm
Posts: 29
Well;

I went down the path of modifying the piggy back and using the high beam fuse option.
It was simple, reversible and impossible to stuff up.

I simply removed the R/H high beam fuse and fitted a piggy back fuse take off.
But I had to modify the piggy back because the wire comes out the side and this interfered with the relay next to it.
A simple job of cutting the insulation and bending the tag, then using liquid insulation to re-insulate the termination.

For those unfamiliar with a piggy back, it is simply two fuses on top of each other.
They work off the fuse holder and feed power to the two fuses.
The fuses work independently,
The one on the bottom does the job of the first fuse.
The one on the top is where the wire come out to give a feed.
But you have to know which side of the fuse holder is live otherwise the top fuse may not function as a fuse.
Just to be safe, I only put a 5 amp fuse in the top fuse (the takeoff) and used the 10 amp original for the normal fuse.
That way the top one will blow first, if there is a short.

The picture below shows the installation.
To remove it you pull out the piggy back and re-install the 10 amp fuse.


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piggy back fuse.JPG
piggy back fuse.JPG [ 142.51 KiB | Viewed 448 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: Dmax switch blanks
PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2019 1:44 pm 
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Joined: Sat Oct 12, 2013 5:36 pm
Posts: 1573
Valkie
Seeing the relay coil fed from the piggy back 5 amp fuse is only a current of approx. 0.2 amps a 5 amp fuse is ok and serves the purpose and is pretty normal. Even so the 5 amp fuse is 25 times more than the relay coil current so ample supply.
Good to find the right spot like that and hope all works well.


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 Post subject: Re: Dmax switch blanks
PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2019 5:15 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jun 07, 2019 4:40 pm
Posts: 29
mydmax wrote:
Valkie
Seeing the relay coil fed from the piggy back 5 amp fuse is only a current of approx. 0.2 amps a 5 amp fuse is ok and serves the purpose and is pretty normal. Even so the 5 amp fuse is 25 times more than the relay coil current so ample supply.
Good to find the right spot like that and hope all works well.


It works great.
But the old halogen lights are a bit yellow when compared with the MUX LED headlights.

I think I may have to purchase some nice new LED driving lights.
These lights have been on my old car and were more than sufficient on it.
But they are barely visible against the MUX headlights.
Who would have thunk it, 120 watts dim compared to the MUX standard headlights.


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 Post subject: Re: Dmax switch blanks
PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2019 6:51 pm 
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Joined: Sat Oct 12, 2013 5:36 pm
Posts: 1573
Valkie
Are the relay/s running the older Halogens getting their heavy current supply via heavy wiring from source to relay and heavy to each light? if not they will be running low on voltage and be dim.

I run all lights via a heavy wire from the alternator terminal, not the battery. If relays connected to battery , then the alt to battery cable is also in the circuit of the lights and under heavy charging the voltage at the battery will be less than optimal. The alt IS the basic source of all power, not the battery. On a previous vehicle I ran the relays for both driving lights direct from the alternator with heavy wiring. I only used 55w globes and the resulting 14v at ALL lights meant the 55w spotlights were far brighter than nearly all 100w globes of other vehicles. It is the colour temp which you are after. 120w absolutely demand everything to be top notch or they will be low voltage and dimmer than a 55w globe. A 55w globe demands 1/2 the current of a 120watt globe, easier on alt and everything in circuit. Change tp 55w globes and watch the light output increase beyond expectations. I have never use 100w or more globe for that reason. cost more too. When a 100w globe stars it instantaneously draws in excess of 24 amps or 120 watt even more. That means the temp shock on startup reduces the larger globes life, 55w lightup easily, draw less in any situation and last.


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 Post subject: Re: Dmax switch blanks
PostPosted: Tue Aug 13, 2019 5:37 am 
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Joined: Fri Jun 07, 2019 4:40 pm
Posts: 29
mydmax wrote:
Valkie
Are the relay/s running the older Halogens getting their heavy current supply via heavy wiring from source to relay and heavy to each light? if not they will be running low on voltage and be dim.

I run all lights via a heavy wire from the alternator terminal, not the battery. If relays connected to battery , then the alt to battery cable is also in the circuit of the lights and under heavy charging the voltage at the battery will be less than optimal. The alt IS the basic source of all power, not the battery. On a previous vehicle I ran the relays for both driving lights direct from the alternator with heavy wiring. I only used 55w globes and the resulting 14v at ALL lights meant the 55w spotlights were far brighter than nearly all 100w globes of other vehicles. It is the colour temp which you are after. 120w absolutely demand everything to be top notch or they will be low voltage and dimmer than a 55w globe. A 55w globe demands 1/2 the current of a 120watt globe, easier on alt and everything in circuit. Change tp 55w globes and watch the light output increase beyond expectations. I have never use 100w or more globe for that reason. cost more too. When a 100w globe stars it instantaneously draws in excess of 24 amps or 120 watt even more. That means the temp shock on startup reduces the larger globes life, 55w lightup easily, draw less in any situation and last.



As you say, that would be the ideal setup.
And I have run spotties like that before, and blown globes.
Im a little reluctant to do this with the MUX and its "Intellegent" alternator, I dont know what the reperciussions would be.

Additionally, while the car is running there is 13.5 volts at the +ve terminal when I measure it, but probably not all the time.
The +ve terminal gets its power from the alt, so its almost the same, and the battery acts like a capacitor (is a capacitor) and smooths out any surges.

I run 50 amp cables from the +ve terminal to the 60 amp relay.
The wiring I use for the driving lights are mine rated 100 amp wires, shielded and with braided metal abrasion shielding as well. (its free and cannot be easily cut or rubbed through)
The negative side of the driving lights are attached to the chassis, but I also run a 50 amp cable from the bolt to the -ve side of the battery.
I believe there is little if any loss in my circuit (overkill, but the wires are free from work.)
I calculated that I pull, with both headlights, around 20 amps, give or take.
This was plenty to outshine the old Xtrail headlights, but the headlights on the Xtrail were not as bright as the MUX.

I have been researching LED lights.
Some start as low as $100.00, not that I'd buy them, but I think around the $200.00 to $300.00 range should be OK.
I dont think any LED lights warrant the $1200.00 I found for one set, unless they drive the car for me.

With my birthday coming up, and my tax refund, I should have enough to get my roof racks and some nice LED spotties, unless the grubberment play hard ball.


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